Characterisation.
Aug. 29th, 2010 09:52 pm![[personal profile]](https://www.dreamwidth.org/img/silk/identity/user.png){kind=small}
shade184Okay. Let's assume there is a character whose mother was a Breton and whose father was an Altmer. He grows up to find that he has the Altmer's height and extra magicka, and also the Breton's skin colour and magicka resistance, but not the Altmer weakness.
After hearing those facts alone, without waiting for more, he was kicked out of my old RP group. That's the other reason why I left them.
So now we have this big guy who's basically going to grow up to be a walking magicka battery. Before you ask, yes, he has a realistic backstory. He has flaws. He has hopes and dreams. There is a legitimate reason for his immense potential, that I will not reveal at this time.
So tell me... is he a Mary Sue? I created him because I had a good story, but I really, really, REALLY do not want to have to explain myself for having this guy. I've already thrown together an extra bunch of stupid fucking flaws to counter his strengths, but I really don't want to have to implement them, because that's not who he is.
I don't intend to RP with this guy, because I would have to nerf him to fit the rules unless we were doing a high-powered session. He is one of those rare people who is legitimately stronger than most others. And don't tell me that people like that don't exist. What about the Hero Of Kvatch? The Nerevarine? They were player characters too, just like this guy.
The widely accepted definition of a Mary Sue is not someone who is powerful, but someone who is deliberately overpowered for no reason other than that the creator wants a powerful/beautiful/"awesome" character. I appreciate a good, well-rounded character as much as you. I know you guys understand that, but I still feel annoyed that I have to say it for anyone reading this who doesn't.
So yeah. Does this guy sound like a Mary Sue to you? Please be honest.
Also! I don't know how many of you use Firefox, but for those of you who do, go here. This is a LIFESAVER.
ETA: I was discussing it with someone on dA, and this is what we came up with. It's directly copy/pasted, so all spelling mistakes should be regarded as (sic).
--------------------------
Merela:
It's the problem with offsprings from twho different races: do they inherit from the mother, from the father, from both? I might be wrong but I think I remember reading somewhere (maybe it was on the Imperial Library) that such an offspring inherits the apparence and the racial abilities of the mother, possibly with some minor physical features from the father, but that's all.
You have a point: heroes are people with great potential. More potential than Pedro the farmer at least (even if farmers are heroes on their own). But for me it's more a matter of skills than brut potential: even Pedro woud kick the ass of a walking magicka battery if said battery doesn't know how to use his/her great potential.
Now, is this character a Mary Sue? Honnestly, for me, as a writter and a roleplayer, it's like your character wears a big blinking sign around his neck saying "warning". Not that he IS a Mary Sue - I don't know his story after all - but that he's on a really sticky wicket. The line is thin between powerfull and overpowered character, and it doesn't help that you don't want to explain yourself or nerf the guy.
I understand your feelings, it's not always fun to have to restrain a character. But if you have to do it, try to think about interesting flaws and not "stupid" ones. It would only make the character funnier to play with, and more accessible for the other players.
Shade184:
Yeah, I remember reading that; thus his only physical resemblance to an Altmer is his height.
For explaining myself, I will say that a reason for his massive magical ability is (story-wise) because of some heavy manupulation by the Telvanni before he was even born, and (author-wise) because most of the time, he's going to have to take care of more people than just himself. I'm sick of "defender-type" characters who only survive because they're stupidly lucky, so I've not only given him a reason for power, but a (hopefully) entertaining backstory. After all, you know just how crafty those Telvamni can be.
That's about as much as I can give away at this time, but you get the idea. Plus, a good portion of his story (both back and current) is that he's NOT skilled at first. He has potential, but he makes a lot of mistakes.
I think... I think this guy has the potential to become a Mary Sue. If I don't handle him with care, he's going to be able to pretty much handwave any problems that arise. And if he was just taking care of himself, he would be. (Point of note - I have a scene in mind where he IS only taking care of himself. Cue the epic battle of awesomeness!) But he's not.
As for playing him, like I said, it's not like I'm going to be playing him outside of a high-powered session. He's not designed to work by himself, so I'd only play in him for an escort mission or as a bodyguard or as part of an EPIC MONSTER SLAYING TEAM or something
After hearing those facts alone, without waiting for more, he was kicked out of my old RP group. That's the other reason why I left them.
So now we have this big guy who's basically going to grow up to be a walking magicka battery. Before you ask, yes, he has a realistic backstory. He has flaws. He has hopes and dreams. There is a legitimate reason for his immense potential, that I will not reveal at this time.
So tell me... is he a Mary Sue? I created him because I had a good story, but I really, really, REALLY do not want to have to explain myself for having this guy. I've already thrown together an extra bunch of stupid fucking flaws to counter his strengths, but I really don't want to have to implement them, because that's not who he is.
I don't intend to RP with this guy, because I would have to nerf him to fit the rules unless we were doing a high-powered session. He is one of those rare people who is legitimately stronger than most others. And don't tell me that people like that don't exist. What about the Hero Of Kvatch? The Nerevarine? They were player characters too, just like this guy.
The widely accepted definition of a Mary Sue is not someone who is powerful, but someone who is deliberately overpowered for no reason other than that the creator wants a powerful/beautiful/"awesome" character. I appreciate a good, well-rounded character as much as you. I know you guys understand that, but I still feel annoyed that I have to say it for anyone reading this who doesn't.
So yeah. Does this guy sound like a Mary Sue to you? Please be honest.
Also! I don't know how many of you use Firefox, but for those of you who do, go here. This is a LIFESAVER.
ETA: I was discussing it with someone on dA, and this is what we came up with. It's directly copy/pasted, so all spelling mistakes should be regarded as (sic).
--------------------------
Merela:
It's the problem with offsprings from twho different races: do they inherit from the mother, from the father, from both? I might be wrong but I think I remember reading somewhere (maybe it was on the Imperial Library) that such an offspring inherits the apparence and the racial abilities of the mother, possibly with some minor physical features from the father, but that's all.
You have a point: heroes are people with great potential. More potential than Pedro the farmer at least (even if farmers are heroes on their own). But for me it's more a matter of skills than brut potential: even Pedro woud kick the ass of a walking magicka battery if said battery doesn't know how to use his/her great potential.
Now, is this character a Mary Sue? Honnestly, for me, as a writter and a roleplayer, it's like your character wears a big blinking sign around his neck saying "warning". Not that he IS a Mary Sue - I don't know his story after all - but that he's on a really sticky wicket. The line is thin between powerfull and overpowered character, and it doesn't help that you don't want to explain yourself or nerf the guy.
I understand your feelings, it's not always fun to have to restrain a character. But if you have to do it, try to think about interesting flaws and not "stupid" ones. It would only make the character funnier to play with, and more accessible for the other players.
Shade184:
Yeah, I remember reading that; thus his only physical resemblance to an Altmer is his height.
For explaining myself, I will say that a reason for his massive magical ability is (story-wise) because of some heavy manupulation by the Telvanni before he was even born, and (author-wise) because most of the time, he's going to have to take care of more people than just himself. I'm sick of "defender-type" characters who only survive because they're stupidly lucky, so I've not only given him a reason for power, but a (hopefully) entertaining backstory. After all, you know just how crafty those Telvamni can be.
That's about as much as I can give away at this time, but you get the idea. Plus, a good portion of his story (both back and current) is that he's NOT skilled at first. He has potential, but he makes a lot of mistakes.
I think... I think this guy has the potential to become a Mary Sue. If I don't handle him with care, he's going to be able to pretty much handwave any problems that arise. And if he was just taking care of himself, he would be. (Point of note - I have a scene in mind where he IS only taking care of himself. Cue the epic battle of awesomeness!) But he's not.
As for playing him, like I said, it's not like I'm going to be playing him outside of a high-powered session. He's not designed to work by himself, so I'd only play in him for an escort mission or as a bodyguard or as part of an EPIC MONSTER SLAYING TEAM or something